Apartheid.......

[Avatar]

I don't know about the statistics, but to suggest that the UK is free of racism and "colour" is ludicrous. Personally, I experienced Britain as one of the most rascist places I've ever been.

Just ask any middle to lower class Brit what he thinks about the Pakistani's, the Bangladeshi's, the Somali's, and practically anyone else you care to name. Most times, you'll not get a tolernat and prejudice-free answer.

Just because rascism isn't upheld by law (i.e. apartheid) they think it doesn't count.

--Avatar

[voltaire]

They're both talking out of their hats.

To the guy who's wishing for Apartheid in the UK - you're being ridiculous. What, we're going to segregate off areas Bradford and Brixton for Asian and Black British citizens, and declare Oxfordshire to be a whites only zone? How would that solve anything? Daft.

As for racism in Britain, plainly it's absurd to say that there is no "race" in Britain. Clearly there is, and not just in the police force. However, Britain overall is no more or less racist than anywhere else.

And Avatar, I'm a "lower class" Briton; most of us actually don't think that racism "doesn't count" just because we don't have Apartheid. Most of us dislike racism just as much as upper class English people and South African liberals do.


V

[Moonwalker]

After living in Britain and France for for nearly eleven years now, I don't really know the new SA...as I left when I was twenty, I regularly visit my family, and when there I still sense the presence of 'Apartheid' very strongly, but more so 'Fear'

Yes, I agree, in Britain 'Racism'is live and kicking, same as in most countries in the western world, my ex-wife and son live in France, and I really notice it there, more so in the south, where the French see every North African Arab as an illegal immigrant...

Avatar, how can you call Britain the most racist place you have ever been? did you witness a bad experience? or which other countries are you comparing it with?

MW

[karl_uk]

Racism
1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

Things normally boil down to cultural and economic issues far to complex for a web forum but I suppose a gateway to understanding.

[Orca]

Originally posted by mluuu
let me tell you some thing, just thank the all mighty that you have never been through such a system, apartheid was never good it will never be. be happy with the with the system you live under, i believe it recognises you as human beings right?

Let the truth be known , not even the three legged pot on the top of this web page is a black invention. Now the meaning of the word Appartheid is "seperateness" , which means that one would like to live seperate from others with whom you do not wish to mix and this to my mind should be any persons right no matter what colour or race you are. Appartheid is practised all over the world every day , muslims stick to their religion , so do christians, even black folks stick prodominantly to their own in areas of their own so the only reason why apparheid was villified is because it was enforced by law. Even today most people believe you should not be forced to mix with those you do not want to, in principal we all believe in appartheid now dont we?? More important now is the issues surrounding the new racism in SA namely BEE and affirmative action. This evil was firstly adopted by the Americans to right the imbalances of the past , however their minorities were the ones to benifit and in our case the minority is now being opressed. In America redistributing the available jobs among the black minorities in principal could work , here you could take all the whites out of their jobs , replace them with blacks and it wont make a dent in black unemployment. So.. to add insult to injury our government enforces black empowerment meaning in a nutshell if you start any business you need to as a white person put up all the finance do all the work and give some blacks shares in your business. If you do not comply with these rediculous rules forget about any contracts or licensing requirements you will not get it period. The BEE of course only benefits the select few fat cats in our country the vast majority here still have no income or jobs and our crime rate has spiralled out of control. Many born South Africans like myself and foreigners can and will not spend our money to start a business here just because of BEE so no jobs are created.Existing companies suffering from the burden of BEE enforcement and the incompetence inherited in this policy as a result eventually go belly-up and SA suffers the loss of even more jobs. These evils cause more racial devide than ever before and no one gains at all , but I suppose as long as the fat cats deem these measures to be politically correct it will continue until we become like Zimbabwe. SO FOLKS I TELL YOU THIS, SCRAP THESE **** POLICIES AND WITH THE FOREIGN INVESTMENT AND OURSELVES WE WILL CREATE MORE JOBS AND A BETTER FUTURE THAN YOU COULD IMAGINE !!!!!!!!!. no why couldnt our govt in alltheir wisdom have seen this?? Perhaps they enjoy seeing their fellow black citizens starve to death ?? OH and just for the record for such *******s as mr."never seen Africa"Nubian man , appartheid never benefitted me in any form it only took 2 years of my life in the defense force for nothing , all I own I worked for with blood sweat and tears , can you say the same ???

[SB-Angel]

I was brought up to believe that all men are created equal. Equal? I find this a startling assumption as clearly, this is definitely not so. Humanity is unmistakably divided into two categories – good and evil; which is openly displayed in what we witness daily. Man’s humanity to man and more so their inhumanity to man; those who are vicious and animal-like, waging war and killing and those that are enlightened, peaceful and caring.

Let’s look at the world leaders. See how many of their personality traits can you pick out of this profile.

1. Glibness/Superficial Charm - Language can be used without effort by them, to confuse and convince their audience. Captivating storytellers who exude self-confidence, they can spin a web that intrigues others. Since they are persuasive, they have the capacity to destroy their critics verbally or emotionally.
2. Manipulative and Cunning - They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They dominate and humiliate their victims.
3. Grandiose Sense of Self - Feels entitled to certain things as "their right." Craves adulation and attendance. Must be the center of attention with their own fantasies, as the "spokesman for God," "enlightened," "leader of humankind," etc. Creates an us-versus-them mentality.
4. Pathological Lying - Has no problem lying coolly and easily. It is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and able to pass lie detector tests.
5. Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt - A deep-seated rage, that is split off and repressed, is at their core. Does not see others around them as people, but only as targets and opportunities. Instead of friends, they have victims, and accomplices who end up as victims. The end always justifies the means and they let nothing stand in their way.
6. Shallow Emotions - When they show what seems to be warmth, joy, love and compassion, it is more feigned than experienced and serves an ulterior motive. Outraged by insignificant matters, yet remaining unmoved and cold by what would upset a normal person. Since they are not genuine, neither are their promises.
7. Incapacity for Love - While they talk about "God's love" they are unable to give or receive it. Since they do not believe in the genuineness of their followers' love, they are very harsh in testing their devotees and expect them to feel guilt for their failings. Expects unconditional surrender.
8. Need for Stimulation - Living on the edge, yet testing the beliefs of their followers with bizarre rules, punishments and behaviors. Verbal outbursts and physical punishments are normal.
9. Callousness/Lack of Empathy - Unable to empathize with the pain of their victims, having only contempt for others' feelings of distress and readily taking advantage of them. Their skills are used to exploit, abuse and exert power. Since the follower cannot believe their leader would callously hurt them, they rationalize the behavior as necessary for their (or the group's) own "good" and deny the abuse. When devotees become aware of the exploitation it feels like a "spiritual rape" to them.
10. Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency - Usually has a history of behavioral and academic difficulties, yet "gets by" by conning others. Problems in making and keeping friends; aberrant behaviors such as cruelty to people or animals, stealing, etc.
11. Irresponsibility/Unreliability - Not concerned about wrecking others' lives and dreams. Oblivious or indifferent to the devastation they cause. Does not accept blame themselves, but blame their followers or others outside their group. Blame reinforces passivity and obedience and produces guilt, shame, terror and conformity in the followers.
12. Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity – Totalitarian leaders frequently practice promiscuity, child sexual abuse, rape and sexual acting out of all sorts. This is usually kept hidden from all but the inner circle. Stringent sexual control of their followers, such as forced breakups and divorces, removal of children from parents, rules for dating, etc.
13. Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle - Tends to move around a lot or makes all-encompassing promises for the future. Many groups claim as their goal world-domination or other utopian promises. Great contrast between the leader's opulent lifestyle and the followers' impoverishment. Support by gifts and donations from the followers who are pressured to give through fear and guilt. Highly sensitive to their own pain and health.
14. Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility - Changes their image and that of the group as needed, to avoid prosecution, to increase income, and to recruit a range of members. Is able to adapt or relocate as needed, to preserve the group. Can resurface later with a new name, a new front group, and a new twist on the scam.

And a few other related qualities: Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them; Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them; authoritarian; secretive; paranoid; only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired; conventional appearance; goal of enslavement of their victim(s); exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life; has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim's affirmation (respect, gratitude and love); ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim.

You have just read the mind-manipulating personality profile of a sociopath and probably the personality profile of several prominent world leaders -- the very leaders who exercise their exceptional abilities to charm and seduce their followers, as well as the media. The self-same media that foolishly allows itself to be manipulated and hoodwinked and that, in turn, reports its misguided findings to the masses, whose reports we naively believe.

Now, let’s have a look at Mandela. What is his claim to greatness – is it because he’s a world renowned politician? I doubt that. World leaders coerced the media into a Mandela frenzy, which was certain to make him a legend before he was released from prison. He had been sanctified by the press as a man of glory, but the press conveniently forgot why he had been imprisoned for 27 years. Power moguls, the world, over spent decades manipulating the country’s political affairs to a point where South Africa became ungovernable; and to save his countrymen from what would have been a bloody massacre in a looming civil war, President De Klerk’s only option was to release Mandela from prison. Has Mandela written anything of significance? No, he can barely string a coherent sentence together. Others’ thoughts are conveyed in the speeches he delivers, and his autobiography, “Long Walk to Freedom,” was written by someone else. And, as for being a good politician – that is one thing he definitely cannot be accused of, as he has solved none of the country’s problems.

His Comrades from other Marxist states, who helped mould him into the fine statesman that he is today, want him to now wield the silent weapon -- his reputation -- against President Bush. We all knew that he would soon reappear, after taking a well deserved rest from presiding over the country’s immense wealth earned by others and governing over the total destruction of South Africa’s once prosperous economy. The very icon of humanity who left South Africa in chaos and helped reduce a wealthy nation to near poverty, now points a bony finger at America and accuses President Bush of having ulterior motives for the war on Iraq, stating that "… President Bush only wants the oil in Iraq. We must expose this as much as possible."
This, to the nation that campaigned tirelessly for his release and that placed trade embargoes on South Africa, opposing their segregation laws. But Mandela prefers to stand with Saddam not because he believes in Iraq's cause, but because they are Comrades in the real sense.

Is that his halo that's slipping? Are we now seeing the true Mandela? Leaders like Mandela are unable to originate and produce a concept or an idea, so instead, they chose to linger and wait patiently, while others create and construct and build a country, a government infrastructure. Then, they infiltrate and seize power.

The United Nations shows that 55% of South Africa's ethnic population is HIV positive. Interpol and the CIA says South Africa is the world leader in violent crime. Interpol has provided statistics showing that there are more murders and rapes (per capita) in South Africa, than anywhere else in the world.

A renowned South African journalist recently told me that media controls are in place. To cover up their inadequcies, Mandela and Mbeki have created new ways to censor news and hide their disasters. When reporting violent crime, South African journalists need an okay from the local authorities before releasing such stories. The journalist I spoke with told me South Africa’s official police figures are half those shown by other organisations like Interpol, CIA, etc. He said the following: “Everything is so ‘Proudly South African’ as today we almost cannot mention crime. No more crime reporting in full - just ‘briefs’ tucked away on an obscure page so we don't upset the sensibilities of the brainwashed readers who, we are told, do not want to read ‘bad’ news. We seem to have turned into a nation of ostriches, similar to the Jews even after they had stars sewn on their jackets.”

The world media turns a deaf ear to the dying screams of white South African farmers. Woman and children are being killed and raped by black thugs, who are going after them like rabid dogs and purposely eradicating them or infecting them with the AIDS virus. Some folk abroad say that South Africa had it coming, that we are now witnessing the results of years of suppressed anger following years of segregation and suppression.

I totally disagree. We are back to the idea of men being created equal and my argument that this is total hogwash. Men are not created equal – it’s about the fundamental good and evil in man. Take another look at the world leaders and an even closer look at South Africa’s leaders. Look at the ANC government. Good and evil has no colour. Good and evil has no race or nation to call home. Hitler, Amin, Saddam… Mandela, Mbeki… they are all of the same fibre and they know it. All of the evil ones of this world know each other.

And his legacy? What will Mandela leave us to remember him by? White South Africans are fearful of Mandela’s inevitable passing. Many are preparing for the vicious campaign of ethnic cleansing that would follow Mandela’s death. This has been promised by the nation’s Communist Party; threats have been made country-wide that, within hours of Mandela’s funeral, there will be a mass mobilization of some 70,000 armed black men, who will be transported to the city centres and implement various “clean-up” operations. These acts of violence would lead to a revolution.

A police official I spoke with about this said, “Blacks are aware of the plans and often threaten white people, saying that when Mandela dies, they will come back and set the record straight.”

Where will the world press be then?

[Orca]

Originally posted by SB-Angel
I was brought up to believe that all men are created equal. Equal? I find this a startling assumption as clearly, this is definitely not so. Humanity is unmistakably divided into two categories – good and evil; which is openly displayed in what we witness daily. Man’s humanity to man and more so their inhumanity to man; those who are vicious and animal-like, waging war and killing and those that are enlightened, peaceful and caring.

Let’s look at the world leaders. See how many of their personality traits can you pick out of this profile.

1. Glibness/Superficial Charm - Language can be used without effort by them, to confuse and convince their audience. Captivating storytellers who exude self-confidence, they can spin a web that intrigues others. Since they are persuasive, they have the capacity to destroy their critics verbally or emotionally.
2. Manipulative and Cunning - They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They dominate and humiliate their victims.
3. Grandiose Sense of Self - Feels entitled to certain things as "their right." Craves adulation and attendance. Must be the center of attention with their own fantasies, as the "spokesman for God," "enlightened," "leader of humankind," etc. Creates an us-versus-them mentality.
4. Pathological Lying - Has no problem lying coolly and easily. It is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and able to pass lie detector tests.
5. Lack of Remorse, Shame or Guilt - A deep-seated rage, that is split off and repressed, is at their core. Does not see others around them as people, but only as targets and opportunities. Instead of friends, they have victims, and accomplices who end up as victims. The end always justifies the means and they let nothing stand in their way.
6. Shallow Emotions - When they show what seems to be warmth, joy, love and compassion, it is more feigned than experienced and serves an ulterior motive. Outraged by insignificant matters, yet remaining unmoved and cold by what would upset a normal person. Since they are not genuine, neither are their promises.
7. Incapacity for Love - While they talk about "God's love" they are unable to give or receive it. Since they do not believe in the genuineness of their followers' love, they are very harsh in testing their devotees and expect them to feel guilt for their failings. Expects unconditional surrender.
8. Need for Stimulation - Living on the edge, yet testing the beliefs of their followers with bizarre rules, punishments and behaviors. Verbal outbursts and physical punishments are normal.
9. Callousness/Lack of Empathy - Unable to empathize with the pain of their victims, having only contempt for others' feelings of distress and readily taking advantage of them. Their skills are used to exploit, abuse and exert power. Since the follower cannot believe their leader would callously hurt them, they rationalize the behavior as necessary for their (or the group's) own "good" and deny the abuse. When devotees become aware of the exploitation it feels like a "spiritual rape" to them.
10. Early Behavior Problems/Juvenile Delinquency - Usually has a history of behavioral and academic difficulties, yet "gets by" by conning others. Problems in making and keeping friends; aberrant behaviors such as cruelty to people or animals, stealing, etc.
11. Irresponsibility/Unreliability - Not concerned about wrecking others' lives and dreams. Oblivious or indifferent to the devastation they cause. Does not accept blame themselves, but blame their followers or others outside their group. Blame reinforces passivity and obedience and produces guilt, shame, terror and conformity in the followers.
12. Promiscuous Sexual Behavior/Infidelity – Totalitarian leaders frequently practice promiscuity, child sexual abuse, rape and sexual acting out of all sorts. This is usually kept hidden from all but the inner circle. Stringent sexual control of their followers, such as forced breakups and divorces, removal of children from parents, rules for dating, etc.
13. Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle - Tends to move around a lot or makes all-encompassing promises for the future. Many groups claim as their goal world-domination or other utopian promises. Great contrast between the leader's opulent lifestyle and the followers' impoverishment. Support by gifts and donations from the followers who are pressured to give through fear and guilt. Highly sensitive to their own pain and health.
14. Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility - Changes their image and that of the group as needed, to avoid prosecution, to increase income, and to recruit a range of members. Is able to adapt or relocate as needed, to preserve the group. Can resurface later with a new name, a new front group, and a new twist on the scam.

And a few other related qualities: Contemptuous of those who seek to understand them; Does not perceive that anything is wrong with them; authoritarian; secretive; paranoid; only rarely in difficulty with the law, but seeks out situations where their tyrannical behavior will be tolerated, condoned, or admired; conventional appearance; goal of enslavement of their victim(s); exercises despotic control over every aspect of the victim's life; has an emotional need to justify their crimes and therefore needs their victim's affirmation (respect, gratitude and love); ultimate goal is the creation of a willing victim.

You have just read the mind-manipulating personality profile of a sociopath and probably the personality profile of several prominent world leaders -- the very leaders who exercise their exceptional abilities to charm and seduce their followers, as well as the media. The self-same media that foolishly allows itself to be manipulated and hoodwinked and that, in turn, reports its misguided findings to the masses, whose reports we naively believe.

Now, let’s have a look at Mandela. What is his claim to greatness – is it because he’s a world renowned politician? I doubt that. World leaders coerced the media into a Mandela frenzy, which was certain to make him a legend before he was released from prison. He had been sanctified by the press as a man of glory, but the press conveniently forgot why he had been imprisoned for 27 years. Power moguls, the world, over spent decades manipulating the country’s political affairs to a point where South Africa became ungovernable; and to save his countrymen from what would have been a bloody massacre in a looming civil war, President De Klerk’s only option was to release Mandela from prison. Has Mandela written anything of significance? No, he can barely string a coherent sentence together. Others’ thoughts are conveyed in the speeches he delivers, and his autobiography, “Long Walk to Freedom,” was written by someone else. And, as for being a good politician – that is one thing he definitely cannot be accused of, as he has solved none of the country’s problems.

His Comrades from other Marxist states, who helped mould him into the fine statesman that he is today, want him to now wield the silent weapon -- his reputation -- against President Bush. We all knew that he would soon reappear, after taking a well deserved rest from presiding over the country’s immense wealth earned by others and governing over the total destruction of South Africa’s once prosperous economy. The very icon of humanity who left South Africa in chaos and helped reduce a wealthy nation to near poverty, now points a bony finger at America and accuses President Bush of having ulterior motives for the war on Iraq, stating that "… President Bush only wants the oil in Iraq. We must expose this as much as possible."
This, to the nation that campaigned tirelessly for his release and that placed trade embargoes on South Africa, opposing their segregation laws. But Mandela prefers to stand with Saddam not because he believes in Iraq's cause, but because they are Comrades in the real sense.

Is that his halo that's slipping? Are we now seeing the true Mandela? Leaders like Mandela are unable to originate and produce a concept or an idea, so instead, they chose to linger and wait patiently, while others create and construct and build a country, a government infrastructure. Then, they infiltrate and seize power.

The United Nations shows that 55% of South Africa's ethnic population is HIV positive. Interpol and the CIA says South Africa is the world leader in violent crime. Interpol has provided statistics showing that there are more murders and rapes (per capita) in South Africa, than anywhere else in the world.

A renowned South African journalist recently told me that media controls are in place. To cover up their inadequcies, Mandela and Mbeki have created new ways to censor news and hide their disasters. When reporting violent crime, South African journalists need an okay from the local authorities before releasing such stories. The journalist I spoke with told me South Africa’s official police figures are half those shown by other organisations like Interpol, CIA, etc. He said the following: “Everything is so ‘Proudly South African’ as today we almost cannot mention crime. No more crime reporting in full - just ‘briefs’ tucked away on an obscure page so we don't upset the sensibilities of the brainwashed readers who, we are told, do not want to read ‘bad’ news. We seem to have turned into a nation of ostriches, similar to the Jews even after they had stars sewn on their jackets.”

The world media turns a deaf ear to the dying screams of white South African farmers. Woman and children are being killed and raped by black thugs, who are going after them like rabid dogs and purposely eradicating them or infecting them with the AIDS virus. Some folk abroad say that South Africa had it coming, that we are now witnessing the results of years of suppressed anger following years of segregation and suppression.

I totally disagree. We are back to the idea of men being created equal and my argument that this is total hogwash. Men are not created equal – it’s about the fundamental good and evil in man. Take another look at the world leaders and an even closer look at South Africa’s leaders. Look at the ANC government. Good and evil has no colour. Good and evil has no race or nation to call home. Hitler, Amin, Saddam… Mandela, Mbeki… they are all of the same fibre and they know it. All of the evil ones of this world know each other.

And his legacy? What will Mandela leave us to remember him by? White South Africans are fearful of Mandela’s inevitable passing. Many are preparing for the vicious campaign of ethnic cleansing that would follow Mandela’s death. This has been promised by the nation’s Communist Party; threats have been made country-wide that, within hours of Mandela’s funeral, there will be a mass mobilization of some 70,000 armed black men, who will be transported to the city centres and implement various “clean-up” operations. These acts of violence would lead to a revolution.

A police official I spoke with about this said, “Blacks are aware of the plans and often threaten white people, saying that when Mandela dies, they will come back and set the record straight.”

Where will the world press be then?

Yes True SB ANGEL

Tommorrow I will plot to overthrow the SA government , I will plan to blow up Wimpy bars with innocent people woman and children , I will send children to face the police in riots that I have planned and blame the government when they get killed in the line of fire , then I will stockpile enough explosives to blow up the whole of Johannesburg ..... but I will be cought taken to prison for 28 years and come out a hero ... who do you think I am ?? I am a white South African and I must tell you I would have been less fotrgiving if I had spent so long in jail, and mr. Mandela has proven to be a very likable person , but of course we cannot forget why he is so famous after all can we ??